Just Picked Up My First Carver Unit

[slbenz 110]

 

 

Welcome to the forum, slbenz.  Thanks for the pic of your system.  Don't let these crazy guyz force you to buy an amp that you don't need. (altho, you probably will want an M1.0t at some point)

 

As I said in my previous posts, I am quite happy with the setup right now.  I still like having the Emotiva for having 5 channels of power.  I probably will go back to a 5.1 system since I have the Eminent Technology LFT-XII center channel and another set of Magnepan IIIas for the rear surrounds just sitting in storage.  Yes, that is overkill but it produces the best surround sound experience I have ever had at my home.   

[zumbini 6,140]

...By the way, I have seen the BillD reference on modifying the C-1.  Approximately how much does he charge to do the modification?

 

Bill has stated numerous times that he is NOT in the mod business to make money.

He creates the mods for fun and does them for "friends" and forum members in good standing.

Assuming he agrees to take on your project I'd expect to pay for parts and shipping (both ways if it's your unit).

In the past he has declined to put a value on his labor but will usually accept a monetary "donation" or trade.

 

My C-11 was Bill's personal test bed unit and I believe it is the 1st and only C-11 he has upgraded (so far).

It has all new caps and op amps plus he designed and installed a balanced output card specifically for me.

(Bill declined to drill holes in the back panel so I installed my own balanced sockets and terminated them.)

It does NOT include the Sonic Holography circuit upgrade which was not created until a few months later.

He pretty much gave it to me for $200 and I did some finish carpentry work for Bill in trade for his labor.

 

At any rate, Bill is currently recovering from open heart surgery at the Mayo Clinic.

It will be a while but he did say that he planned to work on more mods as therapy when he returns.

[Guest Vintagchris]

slbenz i have been thinking about a tube buffer myself, did yours make a noticeable improvement, how did it change your sound was it worth adding?

 

oh and sweet looking setup and nice gear you have there, i have some Magnapan SMGAs that are currently the fronts and center for my surround setup, gotta love vocals and acoustical music on a pair of pans. 

[oldtexasdog 2,371]

I have a Denon 2808 I use for 5 cannel HT with a full set of Wharfdale speakers. Then--I use a M-1.0t MKII op2 with my B&W's for two channel only off the Denon on it's 6 channel. Don't need buffer or tubes as the t=tube transfer sound. So if you ever decide-get one of the t's Just my 2 cents worth.

[madmike46 396]

Welcome to the forum slbenz, nice gear you have there, stick around and enjoy the show. You will find a few OCCD enablers on here.

[slbenz 110]

 

 

slbenz i have been thinking about a tube buffer myself, did yours make a noticeable improvement, how did it change your sound was it worth adding?

 

oh and sweet looking setup and nice gear you have there, i have some Magnapan SMGAs that are currently the fronts and center for my surround setup, gotta love vocals and acoustical music on a pair of pans. 

 

Been very happy with the performance of the tube buffer.  Adds additional warmth and detail to the music.  It brings an additional layer of liveliness to the performance.  And with the ability to tube roll, the Yaqin makes it easy.  I can tell you from direct experience, the Yaqin bests the Musical Fidelity tube buffer because of its ability to tube roll.  Sure the stock tube that came with the Yaqin is nothing to write home about but once you tube roll, the Yaqin will easily best the Musical Fidelity.  So in summary, I would recommend the use of the Yaqin tube buffer in any SS system.  Especially if you are using a set of Magnepans.    

[SteveFord 1,060]

Welcome to the forum.

Tubes and Maggies are a good combination!

I don't have a tube buffer to try with BillD's modified C1 but I think that it would benefit from one despite the source and amps being tube gear.

Maybe a little bit down the road, there's always something to scheme about getting.

[slbenz 110]

 

 

Welcome to the forum.

Tubes and Maggies are a good combination!

I don't have a tube buffer to try with BillD's modified C1 but I think that it would benefit from one despite the source and amps being tube gear.

Maybe a little bit down the road, there's always something to scheme about getting.

 

The Yaqin tube buffer I use can be used with tube equipment for an added benefit.  But the only caveat is that it is useful on equipment that costs below $10K according to Yaqin but my experience doesn't match their statement.  I have tried it with some custom tube amps by Bruce Moore powering a set of Genesis speakers or VMPS and still heard a nice benefit.  Also, with a Sunfire multi-channel amp powering a complement of Definitive Technology speakers.  That little Yaqin does a great job for the price.  You are correct, tubes and Maggies are a great combination.       

[slbenz 110]

Everyone,

Because of all the discussion about the Carver M1.0t power amp, looks like I will be auditioning one this weekend.  Will see how it will compare to my Emotiva XPA-5 in two channel.  Will let you know how it goes. 

[oldtexasdog 2,371]

Looking foward to your impressions.

[RPA-1 Man 606]

slbenz,

 

I have a C-1 which I use it with an Emotiva ERC-2 cdp and RPA-1 power amp. I've gone through my C-1 thanks to encouragement from BillD and other members here. Mine has the BillD mods as well as all 1% metal film resistors installed. I really love the way it sounds. It replaced an Emotiva USP-1 which I was extremely happy with. The major issue I have with the USP-1 is that it does not have a true tape loop. Huge downfall since I use a DBX 231 eq. I still use a cassette deck as well so having two "true" tape loops is essential in my setup

 

The USP-1 was the best sounding preamp I've owned to date. But since I modded my C-1 they are sonically equal to my ears. But, as I stated, the C-1 gives me much more flexibility. 

 

I'll be waiting your impressions on the M-1.0 as well. 

[slbenz 110]

Hello Everyone,

 

Had a chance to extensively compare the M-1.0t to the Emotiva XPA-5 this weekend.  As a background, I have been using my Emotiva for the last two years.  It replaced a Parasound HCA-1205A I had for nine years as my reference amp.  So I had already had the Emotiva on a high benchmark knowing that it replaced my Parasound and having compared it to a $10K Karan Acoustics amp which it beat in my system.  

 

Here are the sound tracks I used to listen to in Marantz DV-9600 as my source and what I found:

Norah Jones - Come Away With Me (Album) - Lonestar

This song has Norah singing at the same time with one of her backup singers.  They are both miked very close together and on lesser system sound like Norah is one person with an echo.  The Emotiva can discern the difference of these two singers where Norah is in the middle and the backup singer is just to the right of her.  But in the Carver, it gave the impression that the backup signer is not only to the right of Norah but also behind her.  There was the first sense of depth I have experienced with this sound track.  Norah's voice sounded more liquid on the Carver than the Emotiva which made the Carver easier to listen to.  Also, the overall depth and soundstage was wider and deeper on the Carver.  

 

Diana Krall - The Girl In The Other Room (SACD Album) - The Girl In The Other Room 

This soundtrack is probably where I was initially most surprised.  The bass guitar on this soundtrack sounded more full on the Carver.  Compared to the Emotiva, the Emotiva has an apparent lack of midbass compared to the Carver.  Listening to the Carver, the bass guitar can easily be located in space where the Emotiva less so because of the lack of midbass I didn't realize was there.  

 

Martin Mann - Le Petit Concert (Album) - Well You Needn't

My friend, Martin Mann, recorded a live album and gave me this copy which I use to check for depth, soundstage and live presence.  This soundtrack has Dmitri Matheny on trumpet playing throughout the stage.  So depth and soundstage is tested here.  As expected, the Carver did not disappoint.  I really felt that my friend and Dmitri were playing in my living room on stage.  With the Emotiva, I get a sense of the depth of movement from Dmitri moving around the stage but the Carver took it to another level.  By now, I am starting to realize the Carver has a greater sense of depth, soundstage and music presence over the Emotiva.

 

Elton John - Goodbye Yellow Brick Road (DVD-A Album) - Candle In The Wind

This soundtrack was a big surprise for me in regards to the use of the Sonic Holography.  With the Carver, I was able to hear the surround sound effects even though I am only using two channels.  The Carver really gave me the sense of wrap around sound where the Emotiva gave me the sense of sound to the side of me.  Again, a deeper and wider soundstage was present on the Carver and even though this is a DVD-A disc, the Carver gave Elton John's voice a more liquid and realistic presentation where the Emotiva was very good to begin with.     

 

Overall Impressions:

The Emotiva XPA-5 is by far a value leader and can compete with many amps costing several times its price.  But in this amp comparison found that another value leader beat it out.  The Carver presented a greater sense of depth, soundstage and music presence over the Emotiva.  As I did more extensive testing, I found that the Carver was not fatiguing to listen to at all for long periods.  When I switched back to my Emotiva, long-term listening was more fatiguing when compared to the Carver.  Also, another difference I could hear between the two amps was the apparent size of the image.  Seems that the Carver increased the size of the singer or instrument played to true life-size.  This is a hallmark with Magnepan speakers but the Carver seems to do this better than the Emotiva.  In comparison, the Emotiva felt more one size-fits-all.  

 

With all this writing and reviewing, you are all probably wondering, what have I decided.  So yes, I agree the Carver M1.0t is a fine power amp and bested my Emotiva XPA-5 multi-channel amp.  Is this a fair comparison?  A dedicated two channel amp vs. a five channel amp only using two of its channels.  All I know is that I bought the Carver and currently have it installed into my system.  Like my Emotiva, it has lots of power and unlike what others say about the apparent lack of bass, I did not experience this at all.  Also, this particular Carver amp does not exhibit the "thump sound" when you turn it on/off.  I don't use the on/off switch anyhow since I have my Panamax turning the amp on/off as well as the Carver C-1 for me.  Now back for more listening enjoyment.   

 

And for those of you who asked for pictures, here you go and look at what is next to my Carver C-1:

  

 

 

 

[zumbini 6,140]

Looks like we're gonna make a Carver convert out of you after all slbenz.

 

BTW - The stock M-1.0t sounds pretty darn good, but wait till you hear the MKII!

[slbenz 110]

 

 

Looks like we're gonna make a Carver convert out of you after all slbenz.

 

BTW - The stock M-1.0t sounds pretty darn good, but wait till you hear the MKII!

I think I pretty much am.  Just did another listening session.  This time at reference levels since no family around.  That Carver sure can play loud and clear.  Louder than my ears can handle.  Never thought my Magnepans could play that loud.  Tried some AC/DC this time and now my Magnepans can hit pretty hard for planars.  I may do the MKII upgrade later down the road, especially when the caps age and go out.  In the meantime, I will be enjoying the Carver.  Funny how my two Carver units and my Magnepans are from the same era.  Seems late 80's technology synergize this time.  It's just too bad my low boy storage unit isn't wide enough to place the two Carver units behind the glass doors.  Just a half inch shy!  

[RPA-1 Man 606]

Nice reviews slbenz. I also noticed slightly more mid bass when comparing my brothers M1.5t to my RPA-1. But When I compared his TFM-55 to the RPA-1 the sound at normal to moderate levels was pretty much identical. The TFM-55 did seem to have endless power in comparison though when cranked up. The TFM-55 is rated at 375w/ch @ 8ohms so it would have more headroom as well.

[weitrhino 1,425]

Did someone say 'Game on' ?

[slbenz 110]

Decided to add to the bottom of the C-1 and M-1.0t a set of Herbie's Tenderfoot.  Added more clarity, imaging and detail to the components.  The Tenderfoot also reduce the low hum coming from the M-1.0t's power supply.  The Herbie's Tenderfoot did the same to the Carvers as it did for my Emotiva amp.  Just more musical goodness.  Still enjoying this vintage combination goodness.  

[sanford lindstrom 35]

Thanks for your recent review comparing the Carver M1.0t to your Emotiva amp.  Very informative.

 

I am still amazed at how well our what is now vintage Carver gear stands up to new comparatively priced equipment in the marketplace. 

 

Has anyone done a comparison and review of any of the new generation multi thousand dollar amps against the M1.0t either stock or Mark II?  

 

Vintage Carver not only looks good in a stack of equipment but sounds great when compared with more modern gear.

[RichP714 3,153]

.....Has anyone done a comparison and review of any of the new generation multi thousand dollar amps against the M1.0t either stock or Mark II?

 

there are two comparison topics to high dollar amps I can think of:

 

http://thecarversite.com/yetanotherforum/default.aspx?g=posts&m=30186#post30186

 

http://thecarversite.com/yetanotherforum/default.aspx?g=posts&m=14523#post14523 

 

 

[sanford lindstrom 35]

Thanks for links to the reviews.

 

 

[slbenz 110]

 

 

Thanks for your recent review comparing the Carver M1.0t to your Emotiva amp.  Very informative.

 

I am still amazed at how well our what is now vintage Carver gear stands up to new comparatively priced equipment in the marketplace. 

 

Has anyone done a comparison and review of any of the new generation multi thousand dollar amps against the M1.0t either stock or Mark II?  

 

Vintage Carver not only looks good in a stack of equipment but sounds great when compared with more modern gear.

 

Thanks for the compliment.  I was initially skeptical that the Carver amp was going to better my Emotiva amp.  I do know that my former Parasound amp sounded about the same as the $10K Karan Acoustics two channel amp I was able to demo in my system.  And the Emotiva amp bettered the Parasound in bass, dynamics and is more forward in its presentation.  When I played the Diana Krall track, the Carver also reminded me of a very similar sound to a custom tube amp valued at $50K a friend of mine has.  Capturing similar details, presence, imaging, dynamics and warmth from what I remember.  All I can say is that little Carver power amp does a surprisingly great job at playing music.    

[sanford lindstrom 35]

I have always liked my C-1, M1.0t combination.

 

The mods that BillD has developed for the C-1 take it into another league entirely.   I am looking forward to having the Mark II treatment done on one of my M1.0t amps.  I can't wait to hear the results.

 

As a side note, I have been pleased with my Emotiva UMC-1 as my theater pre-pro in my future new house.  I would rate the sound quality of two channel content at at approximately the level for the UMC-1 and an umodified Carver C-1.  This was an unexpected pleasant surprise for the UMC-1.  There is no contest between the BillD modified C-1 and UMC-1.

 

I would have expected better results from your Emotiva Amp given the fact of 20 plus more years of development since the time our Carver amps were manufactured.

 

Given the longevity of this equipment, our per year cost is low.  The only problem is OCCD that addicts one into acquiring more Carver gear!!

 

[slbenz 110]

You are absolutely right.  As with other technologies, process is to move forward.  I guess Bob Carver was waaaay ahead of his time.  Honestly, I expected that the Carver amp was going to lose to the Emotiva amp because as you said, technology advances.  I was thinking that if the Carver amp lost, I could turn around and sell it for the same price as I paid for it.  All this because of my interest in the Sonic Holography in the C-1.  Now I have to think about what I am going to do with the Emotiva XPA-5 since I don't have my system in a 5.1 configuration.  

[sanford lindstrom 35]

I have come to the conclusion that my Carver C-1, M1.0t combination will power my Martin Logan Requests.  I will use my Emotiva UMC-1 and Carver AV-705x THX amp with my vintage ADS speakers and my Velodyne Sub for my home theater.

 

Seems crazy to have two separate setups in the same room, but I think that sonically this will be the best setup for our situation.  Also my wife has a high WAF for equipment (she wanted me to buy the much larger Martin Logan Monoliths rather than the Requests), but a very low WAF as to ease of operation. Two separate systems will insure that she does not even have to switch sources when moving from audio to video content.

 

By the way I changed of my LED in my C-1s and the all but the two top rows in my M1.0ts from red to blue.  Great beginning project for someone like me that does not have a lot of electronics or soldering skills.  This change really upgrades the look of the Carver gear.   

 

 

 

[slbenz 110]

 

 

I have come to the conclusion that my Carver C-1, M1.0t combination will power my Martin Logan Requests.  I will use my Emotiva UMC-1 and Carver AV-705x THX amp with my vintage ADS speakers and my Velodyne Sub for my home theater.

 

Seems crazy to have two separate setups in the same room, but I think that sonically this will be the best setup for our situation.  Also my wife has a high WAF for equipment (she wanted me to buy the much larger Martin Logan Monoliths rather than the Requests), but a very low WAF as to ease of operation. Two separate systems will insure that she does not even have to switch sources when moving from audio to video content.

 

By the way I changed of my LED in my C-1s and the all but the two top rows in my M1.0ts from red to blue.  Great beginning project for someone like me that does not have a lot of electronics or soldering skills.  This change really upgrades the look of the Carver gear.   

 

 

 

Martin Logan ReQuests are really nice speakers.  Have heard those and the Monoliths before I purchased my first Martin Logans which were Scenarios.  Your wife sounds very supportive and understanding.  Took me a bit of negotiating with my wife in order for me to purchase the Magnepan IIIa in my picture.  For a while I had another set of IIIas for the rear surrounds in my 5.1 system.  My wife thought I was nuts having two pairs of Magnepan IIIas for our home theater.  I may real soon put my 5.1 system back together again if my wife let's me take over the whole living room again.