Guest Lakadian Posted July 8, 2012 Posted July 8, 2012 I just bought two subs from my local music store for $75. Not each. For both. I bought it because I'm building a couple of 2x10 bass guitar cabinets and was going to use the speakers. Then I decided to do a bit of research. I don't have a pic available, but I'm trying to figure out what I have. The control plate reads: Bob Carver's (this is actually in script) SUNFIRE LABORATORIES PROFESSIONAL I've searched pics online and other than the print it looks exactly like a "True Subwoofer Mk2" with a few exceptions. The entire cab is coated with a rough, durable textured finish, the power cable is hardwired in and the most notable difference I've seen when compared to ANY pics I've been able to track down are the two diagonal bars that run corner to corner in front of the speakers on each side. It has metal corner covers like you'd find on most pro-audio cabs or guitar cabs with a black finish. The bars are actually welded to the opposing corners. The weld is fantastic. I know this sounds like a ridiculous observation to make, but it was actually one of the first things that tipped me that what I had was worth looking into. So... What do I have here, gents? Is it old? If so, how old? Is it worth my while to sell the cabs and buy other 10's? Do I now own two fantastic, if rather short, end tables? I look forward to hearing your professional opinions. Thanks for your time!
oldtexasdog 2,456 Posted July 8, 2012 Posted July 8, 2012 Welcome to the forum. A Pic would be very helpfull.
TNRabbit 371 Posted July 8, 2012 Posted July 8, 2012 Welcome! I, too, am intrigued by what you've found. I've never heard of that particular configuration & would like to see pics.....
SteveFord 1,125 Posted July 8, 2012 Posted July 8, 2012 That sounds like they were thinking about going into DJ gear, doesn't it?
Guest Lakadian Posted July 8, 2012 Posted July 8, 2012 Perhaps now the thread is not "worthless" as you so eloquently suggested. Sorry to have wasted your time thus far. At any rate, does anyone have any suggestions now? By they way, notice that some moron couldn't throw a drop cloth over one of them before apparently spray painting something and got overspray on both speaker and crossbar.
TNRabbit 371 Posted July 8, 2012 Posted July 8, 2012 I don't think weitrhino intended any disrespect. That's a common way (across the entire internet) to goad someone into posting pics on something of interest. You csan contact Sunfire (or perhaps Bill or Rita at Bob Carver Audio Repair) with the serial number & they should be able to give you the details.
Guest Lakadian Posted July 8, 2012 Posted July 8, 2012 Oh, I know. My feelings weren't hurt or anything. lol I was just poking. sry
DaveStL 85 Posted July 8, 2012 Posted July 8, 2012 Now that you mention it, these are on ebay right now: Dominator plate amp Dominator driver
zumbini 6,147 Posted July 8, 2012 Posted July 8, 2012 Looks like Sunfire's pro version of the short-lived Carver Knight Shadow. The Knight Shadow was the predecessor of the Sunfire True series
oldtexasdog 2,456 Posted July 8, 2012 Posted July 8, 2012 Wow that was some serious industral thinking! Not only protect your speaker but give you a handel to carry it with! I WONDER those subs had some very powerfull amps if you could not put a simple low impedance pre for your guitar then just use it for a bass amp?
Guest Lakadian Posted July 9, 2012 Posted July 9, 2012 Yeah, they don't work as a bass amp. I tried that, but they are definitely SUBwoofers. There was a severe lack of definition and it was almost as though there was an octave pedal on the bass. Now, if I tried coming out of the preamp, into a crossover, into a regular 2x10 and a horn cab for my mids and highs and then into that for only the lows...that might be an option. They both work well with my home theater setup, but I'm not really in the market for that right now. Besides, I have a 9 year old, a 6 year old and a 15 month old. I have yet to ever want to crank my home theater setup for Nick JR or Disney. I'd say I'll be putting them on the market as soon as I nail down exactly what I have. For the record, I have emailed Carver repair and I'm waiting on a response. I just enjoy the input of the community. I'm an Ampeg fan and I enjoy a challenge. If somone posts asking about an amp or a cab, I like lookin' numbers and crap up in my own database for kicks and giggles. Don't misunderstand me, I'm not offended when someone directs me to contact the proper professionals and I hope I haven't offended anyone by making these comments. I just wanted to explain why I continue to ask questions at this and other forums. It would be awesome if someone said, "Yeah!! I had two of those just like that years ago! Bought them from Joe Schmoe who bought them directly from Bob Carver himself! Turns out they're prototypes!" Y'know?
zumbini 6,147 Posted July 9, 2012 Posted July 9, 2012 With cutoffs of 35, 65 or 100Hz I suspect your subs were designed to augment a small PA or DJ system. They are certainly relatively unique since no one here has ever come across one before. Similar Carver and Sunfire subwoofers for the home market had MSRP's of $1,200 to $2,200. Today used units sell for $400 to 800 depending on condition. BTW - Back in the late 60's/early 70's I owned an Ampeg Portaflex B-18 Fliptop bass amp. It was a nifty design with a head that stored in the cabinet for transport and flipped 180 for playing. I don't have any photos of my B-18 but here's what they look like.
VTypeV4 37 Posted July 9, 2012 Posted July 9, 2012 Portaflex!!! Lovely stuff there, Z! Have you seen that Ashdown have 're-issued' them with their own particulars? If I was to have one, only an Ampeg would do!
kve777 6,888 Posted July 10, 2012 Posted July 10, 2012 I picked up one of those exact Ampeg amps at a huge flea market for $35.00. It was not working. It was turned into a lamp. I sold it on eBay(minus the lamp bits) for a pretty penny. The trannys were good.
VTypeV4 37 Posted July 10, 2012 Posted July 10, 2012 Definately something about those glowing glass bottles.. Lakadian, dependant on your enclosure design and power handling requirements that I might suggest Eminence Gammas as they seem to do very well in average size vented 2 x 10". I've installed these into Trace Elliot 2103H, an Ashdown MAG210T and a Peavey 210TVX as replacements for blown / damaged drivers. The maths in the software looked good and the results were excellent..
Guest Lakadian Posted July 10, 2012 Posted July 10, 2012 Those old Portaflex Ampegs were sick. I'd absolutely love to have one. Actually Ampeg has recently reintroduced the Portaflex line, but they're solid state. I'm not saying solid state amps suck. I own three solid state Ampegs now. But the beauty of the B-15 (and others in the vintage Portaflex line) was the orange glow of those tubes behind that lucite Ampeg logo. Well, that and the silver grill cloth, the chrome logo on the cabinet, that insane "round sound", that and.....well.... Does it show that I'm an Ampeg fan? I don't hide it well. At any rate, thanks for the advice on the speakers. I've always enjoyed Eminence speakers as well. I have a '74 V-4B stack with the 2x15 folded horn enclosure and I've had Eminence replacements in it since I bought it for $200 in '93. I'll definitely look into the Gammas. I was just bargain shopping for speakers with which to build an enclosure when I found these and turns out, I've apparently made a decent investment. Like I said, both work, so I'd imagine I'll be e-baying them as soon as I get some sort of response from Bill and nail down exactly what I have.
VTypeV4 37 Posted July 10, 2012 Posted July 10, 2012 Ampeg stuff is great, always had respect for it as the few times I have used it, it came up trumps. Personally I'm a Trace Elliot fan although currently I'm using this and have to say that it's fantastic! With regards to Eminence, they make a very robust speaker without too much of a financial kick in the tail. The Celestion range of drive units are also very good, even the budget Tru-vox series give a great sound and seem hardy although the power ratings don't seem to stretch as far. Unless you're buying the new fangled neo-generation units of course! I expect with a V4-B and a double-fifteen, warmth and roundness are more important than worrying which brand of speakers, power handling or magnet flux density etc! None-the-less, good luck with your projects and I'm sure if we can help, we will! Matt
Guest Lakadian Posted July 10, 2012 Posted July 10, 2012 So, I just spoke directly to Sunfire. They don't know what they are either. Or at least the technician I spoke with doesn't and said he couldn't look them up with the serial number. WHAT!? I said, "Well....do you know of a number I could call or speak to someone who might be able to tell me what I have here?" He said, "Well, we're Sunfire." I said, "Exactly. That's kinda why I called you." Then he proceded to tell me that what I have sounds like the Sunfire True Subwoofer Pro from the Sunfire Professional Series. When asked what wattage it was he said it should be listed on the back. When I told him there was no wattage listed, he said he couldn't tell me anything. He told me to Google it. Really? Now that's dissappointing. On a side note, VTypeV4, that rig looks righteous. I'd love to give it a test drive, were it possible. I've always enjoyed Trace stuff as well. A couple of my bassist buddies here in town each have a Trace full stack and I've never EVER been disappointed. Edit: I have since spoken with Bob Carver Audio Repair. I was given the direct line for the Sunfire specialist and was told that he may be able to help me when he comes in. The very nice lady I spoke with verified the Professional Series verdict and said that these speakers were made during a changeover and as such there were few of them made. Whether or not that adds to the value, it definitely adds to the rarity of these particular subs. Hopefully this evening I can get something more concrete and come to a more definite conclusion as to exactly what these oddities are. Thanks for playing along.
zumbini 6,147 Posted July 10, 2012 Posted July 10, 2012 I don't think any of us are too surprised that Sunfire left you hanging. You'll probably have better luck with a Sunfire service tech like Rita at BobCarver.com or Roland at CarverAudioRepair. Another possibility would be to ask Tom at Vintge HiFi of Pittsburgh. or post your photos on his Vintage HiFI forum. Good luck with your quest!
VTypeV4 37 Posted July 10, 2012 Posted July 10, 2012 Cheers Mr L, its a lovely bit of especially when its really considered budget stuff! It's the only 'proper' bass rig I've ever owned that hasn't been a Trace Elliot although I've still got my 600SMX sat as a spare currently. I love those big bottles! If you need any advice on speakers or consider building your own for your bass rig, let me know, i'll be happy to help. Hope you get some good money for the sunfire gear too!
zumbini 6,147 Posted July 11, 2012 Posted July 11, 2012 ...I have since spoken with Bob Carver Audio Repair. I was given the direct line for the Sunfire specialist and was told that he may be able to help me when he comes in. The very nice lady I spoke with verified the Professional Series verdict and said that these speakers were made during a changeover and as such there were few of them made. Whether or not that adds to the value, it definitely adds to the rarity of these particular subs. Hopefully this evening I can get something more concrete and come to a more definite conclusion as to exactly what these oddities are. Thanks for playing along. We're pulling for you Lakadian!
DavidR 32 Posted July 11, 2012 Posted July 11, 2012 ..........................They are certainly relatively unique since no one here has ever come across one before......................... With all due respect we havent heard from Mr. I Have Everything Carver > Kingman
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