Gritting my teeth

[4krow 3,868]

I browsed through the Music Direct catalog today with no intention to begin with. Then, when I look at the music, it is either vinyl or SACD (non hybred). Ok, so assuming that I want to go with a SACD player, how much? Oh about $2,400 for the Marantz N30. Hmm, maybe not. How about vinyl? Well, a Thorens TD120? Direct Drive will run you about $1K mounted with an Audio Technicana cartridge. Well, that's better. Then I remember, of course I have to buy albums again, that is expected, BUT also a good record cleaning machine, and a phono pre amp. Well above the $2,400 of the Marantz N30, and besides my budget doesn't need to start at that level in either case. So say that I have a $1K budget. SACD or vinyl? 

 

 Any ideas?

[RodH 4,802]

The number of available SACD titles is well less than 1% of what is available on vinyl.

Does that help?

[RodH 4,802]

The List

[4krow 3,868]

15 minutes ago, RodH said:

The List

 It all depends on the list. Then, just for fun, I am looking at Marantz SACD players on eBay. Nearly all are from JAPAN. What!? 

 

 Question: Do hybred discs sound better than regular CD disc's? I would doubt it, but want to know.

[RodH 4,802]

The CD layer of a hybrid sounds like a regular CD.

The SACD layer has way more data.

[4krow 3,868]

 That's exactly what I figured.

 

Come to think of it, there are other options (less than 1% of the 1%). My CD player will play those wonderful Mobil Fidelity gold disc's and XRCD, and others that have great results. Maybe I should look that direction first.

[RodH 4,802]

XRCD are redbook CD at the player level. 16 bit @ 44.1 kHz. It was a proprietary mastering process developed by JVC.

[4krow 3,868]

32 minutes ago, RodH said:

XRCD are redbook CD at the player level. 16 bit @ 44.1 kHz. It was a proprietary mastering process developed by JVC.

 True that. Probably the reason that I usually like them is because it is the mastering that is done better, or at least had a better outcome. The fact that HDCD fizzled kind of bummed me out as well. I only had one of those disc's and again I like the quality. To be clear, I realize that it is not all about the process of mastering or even format. A good performance has to come first. Those involved with the recording process have to have their ducks in a row as well. Then sometimes there is the playback machine itself. Mostly I hope for reliability. I have just about had enough of buying machines that turn up with glitches over time, or become outdated much too quickly. Records have made the comeback that I had hoped for, but then there is the total price in the end that I am not taking so well.

[Daddyjt 8,355]

First and Foremost, the artist him/herself needs to give a shit about recording quality. I find it beyond irksome that so few musicians demand high quality recording and mastering. I mean seriously - do they even listen to their CD after their studio work?  I can count the number of “very good” (not even “excellent”) quality recordings from Van Halen, Beatles, Led Zepplin, or The Rolling Stones on NO HANDS.  I KNOW it is possible, because some artists consistently turn out superb recordings - Steely Dan, Alison Krauss, Patricia Barber, Dire Straits...  

 

 

[4krow 3,868]

Well, sure enough when I called my friend in Chicago and asked what was new, he said that he was looking to buy a turntable! This led into a discussion of what was best, what was needed, and what was expected. Yup, part of me really misses vinyl. Part of me doesn't care for the extra effort every 23 minutes. Reminds me of 4 barrel carburetors. 

[Sk1Bum 9,280]

2 hours ago, 4krow said:

Part of me doesn't care for the extra effort every 23 minutes.

 

I call it "cardio."   

[4krow 3,868]

Yes, and I have to admit, it makes you feel like part of the process. I wonder if they will ever make a TT that you can stack, say up to 6 albums on, playing one after another? 🙈

[Rob 3,483]

I remember having an RCA console and my mom would put many LP's on top of each other and let them play. 

 

 

 

Edited January 25, 2021 by Rob

[RodH 4,802]

[4krow 3,868]

Rod,

 

I actually saw the inside of a juke box awhile back. It was more modern than some, but still represented a mechanical work of ingenuity. The part that flipped me out was the fact that the record played in the opposite direction that you would expect. On top of that the cartridge was intentionally mounted backwards at the factory! Made my head spin....   But not as much as the 'Accutrac +6' Anybody remember that nightmare?

[4krow 3,868]

 As I have made aware to everybody on the site, I went vinyl. Today, I got a used Vincent Phono 8 from Fed-Ex. Good. Couldn't wait to heat how much better it was than the $30 phono pre that I was using until this pre got here. Quite a difference. Um, no hum in the left channel. Hey it counts... Still feel that there is more bass than before vinyl, and I already had enough. So we will see about soon. Only listened to a couple of albums and am waiting on shipping for more to arrive. Yup, different than digital. 

For me, it all grinds down to what media I am in the mood to hear. Each has it's own appreciation from me, as long as it is being done well. In a nutshell, I am very happy about this decision, adding yet another alternative foe my listening pleasure.

[bfg4wd 114]

vinyl.

[TJActual 75]

12 hours ago, 4krow said:

 As I have made aware to everybody on the site, I went vinyl. Today, I got a used Vincent Phono 8 from Fed-Ex. Good. Couldn't wait to heat how much better it was than the $30 phono pre that I was using until this pre got here. Quite a difference. Um, no hum in the left channel. Hey it counts... Still feel that there is more bass than before vinyl, and I already had enough. So we will see about soon. Only listened to a couple of albums and am waiting on shipping for more to arrive. Yup, different than digital. 

For me, it all grinds down to what media I am in the mood to hear. Each has it's own appreciation from me, as long as it is being done well. In a nutshell, I am very happy about this decision, adding yet another alternative foe my listening pleasure.

 

It's interesting to me to see a lot of talk about phono pre-amps. Are the phono stage in Carver preamp not that good?

[RodH 4,802]

The phono section in most Carver gear is actually quite good. It was built back in the days when vinyl still ruled.

 

What you are seeing is most likely audio boredom/curiousity and the endless need to keep tweaking systems. And OGCD* of course!

 

 

 

*Obsessive Gear Collection Disorder: a computer virus that can jump the man-machine boundary, infecting the frequent users of audio websites.

[4krow 3,868]

  I laugh. Rod is right. I want to hear sound every conceivable way that I can. As always, we are going to prefer some things over others along the way. I absolutely enjoy the experience, well most of the time.

  Interesting side note, it occurred to me this morning that older albums may be the better choice if I really want the analog experience. What is the point of analog if the vinyl product comes from a digital source? 

[4krow 3,868]

 Ebooks are not for me. Reading off a screen cannot compare to holding the real thing in my hands. I do not read long articles. About 20 minutes, and I am done. >>> All of this transfers to vinyl too! I forgot that most of the time, only one side of an album was listened to and then I was done. Reading the liner notes directly from the album cover is my way as well. These two things came up unexpectedly, and yet are an important aspect of vinyl to me. 

 I will mention vinyl cleaning rituals when the equipment arrives.

[kve777 6,132]

You really need all three sources, Vinyl, Disc and Streaming. If you have the room, and the patience, tape players work, too. Reel, Cassette and 8-Track. Sadly, I have all of those, plus Laser-Disc, AM-FM Tuner, XM Tuner and VHS. Not all in the same place, mind you. I still have to hook up that Quadraphonic system, too. LOL!